Eric: I’ll take one of those Van Morrison CDs, if somebody happens to send you two.

Regarding the Gideons: Last time they were on my campus, I smiled and said “No thanks, I have one” (I did too, right in my backpack), but I did stop to shake his hand and give a word of encouragement. I think he took it pretty well. I can’t say that distributing the Word is a bad thing, even if it is only a NT. Infinitely better than giving out Chick tracts, IMHO.

Also, thanks to the Gideons, there’s always a KJV in any hotel/motel I stay in. There’s something just kind of cool about that.

Thanks for the advice, Jim. It never occured to me to freak them out!

If I thought saints should be praised, I’d say, “Saints be praised!!!” If I were an astrologist, I would thank my lucky stars. But as it is, I can say, without any hint of blasphemy whatsoever:

VAN MORRISON HAS A NEW CD COMING OUT!!!! On the BLUE NOTE label, no less!!!!!!

All of you who have been looking to buy me a gift for under $20, here you go. Strike while the iron is hot.

Eric, I’ve had the same experience with regards to the Gideons. I sometimes wonder if their approach—thrusting Bibles into the hands of everyone they see—is actually productive, though. I’ve seen plenty of people take them just so that they can deface them, or use their pages on art projects, or to smash flies, or whatever. It seems like a waste. Plus, I don’t exactly like seeing the Scriptures abused like that, even though I know there’s no real significance to its physical reproduction.

Scott, I actually think that the Sodom story demonstrates that they weren’t dealing with actual orientations. If these were guys that only liked guys, why would Lot have offered his daughters? No, I think these were men who had adopted the ever-popular “screw anything that moves” orientation.

Eric, their disappointment is simple. They want you to take the Bible anyway and give it away. They view Bible distribution as a sacrament, and they disbelieve that you are a Christian because you weren’t handing out Bibles when they met you.

Or maybe they hear, “No thanks, I already have one” all the time from people who obviously don’t.

Or maybe, they are thinking, “Man, all these Bibles are heavy, and I’ve got to schlep them all over campus. Couldn’t this guy give me a break and take one? What would it hurt?

In any case, I suggest that in the future, you respond the way I do whenever I encounter Gideons, street evangelists, or youth groups handing out tracts. I just mutter

Ph-nglui mglw’nafh Cthulhu R’lyeh wgah’nagl fhtagn.

That usually sends ‘em packing.

The Gideons are on campus today. I think they do a great thing—I am, of course, in favor of as many people having access to the Bible as possible—but I always wonder why they look so wounded and/or offended when they offer me a Bible and I say, “I’ve got one already,” or, if I’m feeling overdisclosurely (yes, I invented that word), “I’ve got several and I’m a Christian.” But, in my experience, the fact that I have a Bible (or several) and the fact that I am a Christian does nothing to dispell the hurt/offended look, and indeed sometimes exacerbates it. Isn’t it a good thing that I want them to have more Bibles to give out to people who don’t have them? It’s almost like they’re saying, “Hey, we’re on the same team—act like it!” But I think I am acting like it, by allowing others to get the Bible I may have needlessly taken. I don’t know; it’s just on my mind.

Happy Birthday, Kurt. Have a Newport on me!

Scott: Griswold is an idiot, clearly, but I’m trying to reason through his points on his own terms. Answering a fool according to his folly, I know. I’m foolish.

Anyway, when the people of Sodom had over time turned en masse to perversion, wouldn’t that be something like an orientation? Also, I don’t recall anything in the NT injunctions at least that point one way or the other. That is, the acts are condemned without any reference to the mindset of the person committing the acts. In fact, when one considers the labeling of the sinner instead of a reference to the sin, I suppose one could make a case that one is clearly singling out the repeat offender, not an isolated “one time at band camp” incident.

Anyway, his idiocy aside, he is right in that as I understand it, Episcopal dioceses are entirely autonomous. That is how the Dallas diocese is headed by a very conservative Bishop, and Griswold can do nothing about it.

Next week, please pray for the gathering of conservative Episcopal leaders here in Dallas. They need wisdom. Lots of it.

This is a real easy year for me in baseball. Since I hate the Yankees, Braves, Giants, and Red Sox (in that order), I know who to cheer for.

Well, the head of the Episcopal Church, Bishop Frank Griswold has said that scriptures do not condemn same-sex relationships. He stated that only “discreet acts” were condemned because they weren’t part of a loving relationship. When confronted with scriptures that call homosexuality an abhomination without respect for the clandestiness of the acts, Bishop Griswell immediately stuck his fingers in his ears and began dancing in place singing “La la la la I can’t hear you la la la.”

BASEBALL: This post-season looks real good. Every series has an interesting angle…

MARLINS vs GIANTS – Two old skips who are reaping the rewards for years of efforts in the game. Both good guys but I’d enjoy seeing Felipe win it all for all his years of quiet patience and Christian dignity with the Expos. Big Guys in 4.

BRAVES vs. CUBS – Perennial winners vs. perennial losers. How can you not cheer for the Cubbies?. I’ll prognosticate with my heart and say Lil’ Bears in 5.

TWINS vs. YANKEES – Team megabucks vs. Team budget. Would love to see the Twins win this one. My heart says the team that was supposed to be contracted should beat the team with the big contracts in 3 – would prove that there is such a thing as justice – but you know that’s not gonna happen. Pinstripes in 4.

A’s vs. RED SOX - Billy Beane vs. the Curse. It’s time the @#$%&* curse was lifted. Crimson Hose in 5

NOTE: Thanks to the lurker who pointed out to me that division series are not best of 7 but best of 5 affairs. Thanks Jonathan!

Happy Birthday, Kurt! Put your teeth in so that you can eat some cake.

Eric, Hothouse Flowers are an Irish band. You can find more out about them here. Amazon has some sound clips.

taps the microphone and winces as it squeals in protest. Clears her throat and begins to sing

Happy Birthday to you
Happy Birthday to you
Happy Birthday dear Kurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrt
Happy Birthday to you!

runs away, laughing maniacally

Does anyone know anything about The Hothouse Flowers? I just got an incredible Van Morrison tribute CD (called No Prima Donna) for an incredible $7.95, and The Hothouse Flowers, with whom I am not familiar, do a great version of Van’s “Bright Side of the Road.” Should I bother to check out more of their stuff?

Just add him to the list.

Actually, Jim, I thought you were the antichrist. (JN) (SW) (BS) (RSVP) (NAACP) (ESPN) . . .

Prince William is the anti-Christ. Now you know.

Scott’s Entertainment Update
I just want to take a moment to say this:

Kill Bill: Quentin T. is preparing to bend us over his knee and give us our first real paddling since Jackie Brown (which I liked). This movie (and it’s sequel) is going to rock like no other movie ever…

until…

The Matrix Revolutions: The trailer for this makes me cry. I nearly soiled meself watching it. It is going to rock our world like no other movie ever…

until…

Return of the King: Seriously, I nearly cried when I saw this trailer. The world will officially suck until next March or April when Kill Bill Pt. 2 is released.

Fascinating Vermont link. I wish I could read the whole thing. I would refrain from comparing it to treatment of Indigenous American Whoozits And Whatnots unless they’re being deliberately or implicitly killed, which I don’t think is happening, and besides I didn’t call even that a holocaust—I said it was the only thing that came close.

Scott: Thank you for putting the Frenchman in his place. I feared he might become angry if I reiterated my earlier distaste for franco-anything, but I had forgotten how ineffectual his anger would have been in any case. How silly of me!

Richard: All in fun, my good man. You had the sense to head west, so obviously you aren’t all bad. I suspect that if you were living back in Montreal, you too would be surprised at how offensive those awful people are. (Note the complete lack of any concrete accusations or facts!)

Jim: I suspect Jesse is actually thinking of the “Trail of Tears,” a truly sad historical event, not just general mistreatment of AmerIndians in general.

Well, about the treatment of Indians (which, I’m told, is preferred over “Native Americans” by most people who identify with this group, which is fair; I typically declare my ethnicity to be “Native American”, since I am, in fact, a native of America…), but Jonah Goldberg has made a pretty good case in the current print issue of National Review (available online via subscription) that liberal out-of-state interests are basically doing to native Vermonters what the U.S. did to the Indians. So if the Indians were subject to a “holocaust”, then maybe Vermonters are too?

Richard: I wouldn’t worry about the 2 of you coming to blows. You supported the French, and I’m pretty sure you would have surrendered pretty quickly. (SW)

PWinn: And to think we nearly came to blows over the French thing (JN)

Phillip: Some things actually are comparable to the Holocaust, of course. But not very many of them, and the only thing in American history that even comes close is the treatment of Native Americans. And even there you can’t speak of organized extermination after the late 1800’s, though there was plenty of racism and hatred involved up through today.

Otherwise, I entirely agree with you. Even if the U.S. is hostile to strangers on our shores, this is in no way comparable to the organized extermination of a whole population, which extended to the point of invading other countries looking for more Jews to exterminate. Really, I’d like to apply Godwin’s Law to pundits. Comparisons to Nazis are the political equivalent of “I know you are but what am I”—they have no real content, and can be repeated ad nauseum whenever you feel like taking the moral high ground.

English-only legislation is a silly, though understandable reaction to the irritation of not being able to talk to people. It’s the price you pay for being a melting pot, though. I consider the surfeit of delicious Thai restaurants acceptable compensation for not being able to speak to 7-11 employees.

Richard: Thanks! I had noted that it was mostly the older folks doing the dipping/bowing thing, not the younger families with kids, so I suspected as much. In fact, I would have assumed that, but Bill did mention that there had been a squabble at the church about three years ago and that the high church crowd all left. So seeing people still dipping made me wonder. I guess those folks are still high-church but didn’t want to be schismatic. Good for them. It’s enough for me that my kids are quiet and ponder the stained glass windows. Praying reverently will be “extra”. As in “extra-unlikely to happen any time soon.”

On credo-baptism, I am very reluctant to start a conversation on this, especially without the iMonk around to put a stop to it, but basically I’ll say this: I’m semi-ambivalent on paedo- vs credo-baptism. If paedo-baptism was going to be an issue, I’d go for it, though I’d generally rather not. Fortunately, you’ve assured me that it probably won’t even come up. As it happens, my oldest kid is about old enough to understand a lot of this for herself. The Episcopalians don’t actually do credo-baptism, do they?

I bet they’ll mention the pledge thing at the confirmation class! Bill did mention that they would have a confirmation class one of these fine days on a Saturday, but that I wouldn’t need to be confirmed at the end of the class if I didn’t want to be. I suggested that I wouldn’t know if I wanted to be or not without attending the class first. Ah, a conundrum!

When my wife and I joined a Baptist church a number of years ago, they accepted my word that I had been baptised by immersion at a Bible-believing church. The pastor shook his head at the thought that it was a tongue-talking church, but he went with it. My wife, it turned out, had never been baptised. Those Word-of-Faithers are funny. Raised by satellite broadcasts of Kenneth Copeland, constantly pleading the blood of Jesus (ack!) and immersing themselves in magic incantations of Psalm 91, they never once thought to obey God’s instructions regarding baptism. I’m not sure if either of her parents are baptised, but I’m pretty sure she is the only one of the six kids to be baptised. The Baptists took care of it, true to their name, and by baptism she became a member. Given the way churches work, she probably still is!

Maybe we’ll sneak our kids off to a Baptist church when they want to be baptised. Or back to Covenant Church, though they moved the baptismal out of the main sanctuary during the recent remodel of the stage. Er, platform.

Anyway, thanks again for the recommendation. At the risk of sounding smarmy, I truly believe that you were used by God to get us to Trinity Episcopal.

Jim: Yes, it’s always bugged me that Philip K. Dick missed out on the extra ‘L’ he deserved. I’m so used to typing my own name that I have to type his name by letting it all out and going back to delete the extra ‘L’ afterward! I have no idea why so many people miss out, the extra ‘L’ is just delightful. And yet, I’m in the minority (report), as most Philips are solitary, including my Biblical forbear.

Phillip:
1. Everyboby calls him Bill. I’m sure he would choke on “Father Bill” – it’s one of those “Low Church” things.

2. I’m sure inviting him to lunch would be fine.

3. The collar is work attire (It does look cool, doesn’t it?)

4. Much of it is learned by osmosis.

About the dipping/bowing stuff I suggest you speak to Bill. I predict he’ll discourage you from doing any of it (“Low Church” again)

The Vestry is the same as the board of deacons at a typical evangelical church.

5. I’m not sure about the confirmation thing.

6. When we were in the Episcopal church we were never required to break our credo-baptist beliefs and practice and we were never encouraged to have our children baptised.

7. I’ve no clue about the pledge thing.

English only laws and rhetoric have always confused me. Having had the opportunity to work with many who have come over from Asia I see no difference than what happened in my own family. From what I was told, my grandparents didn’t speak english very well, they were from another country and older when they got here. At home my parents did not speak a lot of english but in school they learned it and speak it now accent free.

Most of the people who have come here from Asia that I work with tell me they same is true with their kids (who were born here), they barely speak a word of their “mother” tongue and have no problems with english.

Seems to me this problem fixes itself, I know if I went to any other country now, I would never pick up the complexities of the language but any children I had probably would.

Richard: Our first “real” Sunday at Trinity went very well, thank you. I had mentioned to Bill on Wed night that you had expressed concern about starting me down the Canterbury trail, and he suggested that (1) there are far worse paths to travel and (2) I should indeed hold you completely responsible. I suspect he is very curious about us now, since I explained that my wife and I both grew up in Pentecostal and Word of Faith churches and were leaving a Pentecostal church now to come to Trinity. He had a very troubled look on his face, as if he was trying to figure out what to ask next. He never did ask.

It’s been so long since I’ve gone to a small church that I don’t know if I’m supposed to invite his family to lunch on a Sunday afternoon, or avoid personal entanglement of that sort, or what. Ah, well, I’ll figure it out. For that matter, I’m not sure what I’m supposed to call him, exactly. I’ve called him “Bill” when talking about him here and to my family, but I note that the Mitford books feature “Father Tim,” so maybe it should be “Father Bill”? I avoided names in direct address entirely on Wednesday night and Sunday morning. Any advice?

Anyway, on Sunday we very much enjoyed the service. We had missed a couple of week of his series on Mark, and came back in time to hear him speak on the five loaves and two fishes story. The kids, not coincidentally, covered the same story in their classes. There are still a couple of little tiny things about the service with which I’m not quite in sync. Songs without music that follow no tune I can divine, little things like that. No big deal. The kids were again angelic during the time before they were dismissed, which surprised me. Though my son did insist with tears in his eyes that the kneeler be left down for him to put his feet on while we were sitting, just like the folks in the next aisle over were doing.

We headed out the front door after service this time, since I had promised Father/Rector/His Honor/William/Bill that we would say hi. Fortunately, it was easy enough to loop around and pick up the kids. In fact, aside from the pause to say Hi, we might have beat the “crowd” trying to get through the door to the coffee!

I do have a couple of questions you might be able to help me answer, Richard. Or Jack, or anyone who can email me at pwinn@winn.com (you’ll get a message from Spamarrest if you’ve never emailed me before, it’s legit).
1. What do I call the rector? I’m pretty sure “Bill” is okay, as is “Gavin” for the assistant rector, but maybe I’m wrong.
2. So is he expecting me to invite him to lunch? I’d be happy to, but maybe I shouldn’t?
3. Is he required to always wear the cool collar in public, or just while performing church duties?
4. Any ideas on where I can learn about the little things lifelong Episcopalians probably don’t even think about, like dipping and praying briefly before entering a pew, and what exactly the vestry is responsible to do, and maybe others I’m missing?
5. As adult converts (of sorts) to Anglicanism, are my wife and I probably expected to go through confirmation the next time it is made available?
6. Since the youngest of my kids is almost three, am I likely to be expected to have them baptised, or is the “dedication” with a dab of oil on the forehead and prayer with a pastor that my kids had at my last church good enough? Is the dedication invalidated if one of the pastor prayed in tongues? Okay, I’m half-joking on that last part. Seriously, though, Anglicans don’t seem to believe as many Roman Catholics do that the baptism of infants is for the remission of original sin, so ???
7. When do I sit down and make my financial pledge with somebody?

I’m sure there are others, but that’s off the top of my head.

Jim: In chatting with my brother, we quickly got off the topic of what happens to unopposed points in a debate as I actually re-read the piece (I use the term in purpose) in detail and realized just how over-the-top it is. Isn’t it stereotypically racist of him, for example, to assume that “a large number of immigrants learning English for the first time, and poor women coming off welfare” are necessarily going to be the victims of “intolerance and discrimination”? And isn’t it “moral equivalence” when he makes statements comparing the holocaust to “English-only legislation, anti-immigrant crackdowns, and welfare cutbacks thanks to widespread stereotypes and a constant drumbeat of rhetoric against the so-called underclass?”

For that matter, let’s play a Sesame Street style “What’s the difference?” game:
1. English-only legislation (which hasn’t passed, by the way) affects those who don’t speak English, which is a choice. The consequences are confusion and perhaps an inability to take advantage of government services.
2. Anti-immigrant crackdowns (by which I assume he meant anti-illegal-immigrant crackdowns) affect those who are in the country illegally, which is usually a choice. The consequences are that the law-breaker is given a free bus ride or plane ticket back home.
3. Welfare cutbacks affect all people who depend on welfare, not just minorities. In fact, I am offended at the implication that minorities are the primary recipients of welfare! What racist claptrap! In any case, the consequences is that people receive less free money.
4. The holocaust affected people who happened to be born Jewish, and others. No choices, no options. The consequences were deadly and an abomination that will stand four hundreds or thousands of years to come as one of the darkest periods in human history.

So which of these four things isn’t like the others? What a loser!

Anyway, addressing the particular class that is the subject of the article, it seems that they were teaching a class entitled “Learning the Holocaust” and decided, strangely enough, to focus on the holocaust. Go figure? Anyway, let’s pretend, as the author seems to be, that the class is more general and focuses on racism instead. Let’s pretend it is the only class in the entire curriculum that deal with race issues at all, though I’m reasonably sure it is not. If both of those things were true, then they would be guilty of teaching about racism and picking the biggest example of racist horror ever. Wow, what a shock!

You know what would be sick as far as I’m concerned? Outlining things like English-only legislation as an example of the horrors of racism without pointing out that racism can lead to much worse things like the freaking holocaust!

Argh! It’s okay. I’m fine. Thanks for your concern. Just a sip of water, here…No really, I’m fine. Now I remember why I avoid certain websites.

Anyway, as it happens, I am very sensitive to the plight of immigrants, having had some experience with the process. I sympathize with those who cannot speak English, as I’m limited to English and Pig Latin myself despite several wasted years of Spanish courses. And I do truly sympathize with people who need welfare to get by, though my family refused to accept government assistance when we qualified for it when I was young. I am not a hard-hearted man, and I do not deny racism in the here and now. It exists and it is awful stuff. I have been discriminated against based on my age and gender, but rarely if ever because of the color of my skin, and never to the extent that some of my darker-skinned friends have reported.

But we’re talking about the holocaust, man, and nothing compares.

Phillip, I raise the “one el or two” question because the only other Phil in my life is a one-el’er.

So Phillip - How did your first real Sunday at Trinity go?

In my experience a No-Smoking section in a restaurant is about as good as a No-Peeing section in a pool.

Jesse: Everybody mocks the card. What are we up to now, 40 out of 54? 41? It seems to me that they’ve done their job.

And the Tycho link is very funny. Oregon Trail was brilliant, but like most software it simply couldn’t account the incredible complexity of real life. Oh well. I liked 7 Cities of Gold on the C64, too.

Scott: Thanks also for the PDF link. I had found a similar page before, but I like actual books, so I’ll probably still fork over the money. I wish it was $10 instead of $17, but I just found out this morning that my brother gave me a $35 Amazon gift card last Christmas, so I’ll consider that providential and buy two! (The Christmas card and Amazon gift card were in my other brother’s messy bedroom. He was supposed to hand-deliver the card when he visited, but forgot it.)

Jim: I’ll have to run this by my forensics-oriented brother, but I’m pretty sure that there is such a rule within organized debate. According to his IM away message, he’s sleeping now (college kids!), so I’ll have to get back to you.

And there is a rule: Phillip with two ells is correct, all other spellings are wrong. There just isn’t in one ‘L’ to represent who I am.

Scott: I’m not sure which church #5 I like more. ;-)

So you’re from a P/C background, and are current switching from a Baptist to a Presbyterian church? No wonder your mother clucks at you!

I know I’ve had words about a certain particular unfriendly church here during my own search, but I do believe that there are much better opportunities to get to know people than Sunday morning. That’s where all of the visitors show up, after all, and why would you waste time getting to know people that will never come back? The first time we went to Trinity, one determined older woman did introduce us to a few families with younger kids, which was nice, but we really didn’t get the kind of friendly response one might hope for until we went to a Wednesday night service. It helps that dinner is served before the Bible study on Wednesday nights. It might have also helped that the rector sat down by us and yucked it up with us for the half-hour. (Boy, Richard, did he have some stories about you!) (Okay, I was just kidding on that last bit, but he was fascinated with the idea that we had “met through the internet,” meaning the rector and me, via you.)

Anyway, I liked all three Presbyterian churches we went to, more or less, so I hope thinks work out on the friendliness front for you.

JS: I spoke to the French about those cards. They didn’t mean anything by it – they just needed something for the Germans to play with next time they need a break from marching through the streets of Paris.

Phillip, isn’t there a logical fallacy rule that touches on “the fact that we can’t solve every problem doesn’t mean our solution to this problem is wrong”? I thought about that reading the post about holocaust sensitivity training. Also, is there some sort of rule that determines whether one spells it “Phillip” or “Philip”? I’ve seen both recently, though not used of/by you.

Since Michael’s gone, I treat you all to this morning’s top links:

Fellow students at my school, celebrating the start of the year in style.

France comes up with its own spin on the most-wanted card deck.

Tycho of Penny Arcade reminisces about Bible Camp romances and telemarketing. This link only marginally counts as relevant to anything, but I laughed out loud at the reference to Oregon Trail, as will anyone else who spent their formative years playing this game on Apple IIe’s (AA).

Jamey’s very positive review of Luther over at RM

The wife and I have been looking for a new congregation for a couple of years now, and after several false starts, questions, investigations, etc., we’ve finally narrowed our choices down…

First, a review of the churches we went to:

1. Grove Park Baptist – the church we’re members of now. It’s not a bad church, and the music program is second to none in our area. However, I have some concerns about the themes of the sermons, and the focus of those teachings. There’s also an apparent lack of effort to seek the deeper meaning of scripture, and both the wife and I felt that we just didn’t belong and weren’t getting fed. The exception to all of this, as I said, is the music program, which we believe will continue to welcome Anne in playing (she plays clarinet twice a month). Don’t get me wrong – GPBC is not a bad church by any stretch… just no longer right for us. For the record, it came in #3 on our list of churches we want to attend, and if it weren’t for 2 fairly impressive churches at the top of the list, we wouldn’t be leaving.

2. Brookwood Baptist – the church that’s the closest our area has to a superchurch. It’s got a confirmed buttload of members, and services where attendance numbers in the thousands. Lots of activities. Entertaining service. Just not right for us. It’d be a situation where we’d disappear into the congregation and never be seen again.

3. Church of Jesus Christ in Burlington – This is the House Church I grew up in (the name doesn’t signify anything other than a need for a checking account). P/C fellowship where I really love the people, but have found myself moving away from Pentecostal/Charismaticism. My mother still clicks her tongue and does the “Well… that’s your choice” thing every time we discuss the issue. For the record, this house church wasn’t begun as many others were. While many of them were founded by people dissatisfied with modern churches as an act of rebellion, this church was founded by 2 people who felt the need to open up their home as a church – and they’ve been doing it since 1967 or so. Various believers have come through during the years, but all in all, it’s a stable, friendly, well-studied group. It’s really just the tendency to P/C and dispensationalism that bothers me.

4. Antioch Community Church – never really a serious consideration. Pentacharismatic fellowship. They began as an outreach ministry of various P/C churches in the area (including my former house church), and have evolved into a fairly sizable congregation.

5. Harvest Baptist – This church made absolutely no impression on us at all. The most I can recall is that it was a typical SBC fellowship.

5. St. Mark’s Church – I really don’t have anything bad to say about them, except that it just didn’t feel right. I’ve got friends that go here and family that doesn’t acknowledge my existence that go there, but still… maybe it was the size of the church that intimidated us. It’s pretty darned big, and I think we’re in the mood for a more intimate fellowship. #4 on our list, BTW.

6. Bethany Presbyterian – Great congregation. Heavily liturgical in style, with great teaching from a gifted pastor. Friendly. The biggest problems were the wife’s adjustment to a very different service than she’s used to, and the fact that most (95%) of the congregants are over 70.

7. Grace Reformed Baptist – Good, solid teaching. The biggest concern here was church discipline. Having been a former member of an abusive Shepherding Movement church, I’m very concerned about the proper application of church discipline. When it was suggested to us that coming home past a church-decided curfew on a Friday night could net you some discipline, red flags went up and we immediately decided that, whether the rumor was true or not, there was too much free opportunity for abuse.

8. Northside Presbyterian: Another great congregation, this one PCA. Solid teaching. I’d call their worship service semi-liturgical. Biggest issue: very few people said anything to us. We aren’t sure if it’s rudeness or cliqueishness or just normal behavior, but it bugged us.

So… after all that and repeated visits to our top pics, we’ve narrowed our choice down to… Bethany Presbyterian (PCUSA) and Northside Presbyterian (PCA). Basically, we’re going to give Northside a chance to prove that they’re not really as rude as they seemed the times we went (what’s the point in joining a fellowship if no one will fellowship with you?) and we’re going back a few more times. If nothing improves, Bethany Presbyterian’s average age will drop a few years as the chick and I sign up.

Phillip: Pour vous. Now you can print it out. I know it’s not the same as having the book in your hands, but it’s how I got my copy of Luther’s “Bondage of the Will”.

+ The man who inspired me to leave my old church and take a sabbatical of indeterminate length from Pentecostal churches in general has been having some long talks with his wife. It seems that she may indeed be pulled back from the precipice and rescued from certain insanity just in time. Although most of my stories here have been about the dark side of charismania and emphasized the awful stories about my old church, there is still much good, and it isn’t that hard to avoid the wackiness.

I still think a week or two with the 1928 Book of Common Prayer would be good for them both, but I’m happy they’re recognizing a problem and deadline with it before it gets out of hand. – All this sports talks bores me silly. October 8 is the start of the sports season for me, as my beloved and beleaguered Dallas Stars open their season against the Anaheim Mighty Ducks. (ESPN, 7pm Central) – I’d have no problem with Coulter’s book, so long as it came bundled with Moore’s as a two-fer deal. Just like I think every copy of O’Reilly’s and Franken’s books ought to be sold glued to the other. I remember seeing a bit of minor research of blogdom done a while back in which one of the blog link-counting tools was used to determine whether or not blogs “cluster” politically. I’m sure it comes as no surprise to anyone that of blogs with any political links in their blogrolls, conservative blogs linked almost exclusively to conservative sources and blogs, while liberal blogs linked almost exclusively to liberal sources and blogs. It was after reading that and taking a long, hard look at my own blogroll that I sought out and began reading more liberal sites. I still can’t stomach Atrios and a few others, but it is interesting to see things from the other point of view sometimes. The loony you linked to was just that – a loony. I read the first article in his list and laughed out loud. So now we can’t discuss the holocaust unless we’ve first flogged ourselves yet again over our past racial sins? Or is he suggesting that America’s racism in the last 65 years is somehow worse than the holocaust?

Some people aren’t worth the time it take to read what they write, and I didn’t get any further than the one article there. But still I force myself to read the opinions of people with whom I know I disagree, and I think it helps me reason more clearly. Coulter has demonstrated to my satisfaction that she is more interested in offending people than actually thinking. I pair Coulter and Moore like I pair Franken and O’Reilly. Even that’s not quite so fair. O’Reilly is slightly more moderate than hard-core leftist Franken, while Coulter and Moore seem more like two peas at opposite ends of an ideological pod.

+ So at my new church, Sunday mornings are spent going through Mark, while Wednesday nights are spent going through Judges. If only there was childcare provided during the Sunday Morning adult Bible study class before the main service. My kids are not yet well-trained enough to maintain peace and decorum for that hour, but I’m working on it.

+ I’ve already picked a long list of books to order at Discerning Reader out of my next paycheck. If only they carried a 1928 BCP. I’ll have to order that from Amazon. At least I can charge the shorter catechism to the kids’ education budget. ;-)

Hot Dog.

Dr. Piper spoke on worship at a conference at SW Seminary. For you guys that don’t read him, here are some vintage Piper insights on love, joy and worship in a God-centered Christianity.

John Hawkins over at RWN has an excellent post on the Left’s patriotism/Persecution complex.

Can’t say I totally agree- in fact, I see both sides of this- but from the perspective of the fans, having Barry Larkin in a Reds uniform is a very good thing. And having Barry move into the Reds organization is something I do support totally. So the season has one nice final note for us Reds fans. Now, someone help me find a place to stay in Sarasota in March. Please. (Near the water.)

Another infamous artificial turf monstrosity is going to be pulled down. Bye to the Vet, and good riddance.

40 years old. 21 wins. I salute Jamie Moyer, a great pitcher.

Welcome back, Judson. I wondered daily what had happened to you. I really enjoyed reading your adventures in the city by the bay. Sounds like it was a great two weeks, even with those hairy armpits.

We are leaving in the morning for a visit with our daughter, and then a few days with our families. So I won’t be back here blogging till Thursday morning. I’ll be counting on you guys to keep it interesting for the vast lurking multitude out there. Especially interested in your impressions of “Second Hand Lions” or “Luther.”

Just watched “Cold Cases” on CBS. Not up there with CSI, of course, but the premise of solving unsolved cases is interesting, as long as they don’t go overboard on certain obvious cliches. I also like “Two and a Half Men,” a new sitcom with Charlie Sheen. Sort of “The Odd Couple” with a kid. Good writing. We are excited to have our favorite shows back on: The two CSIs and “Without A Trace.”

The folks at church had a surprise birthday potluck for me today, with a very nice gift and two tickets to see Kathy Mathea in Louisville in March. I have some appreciative people. Some new folks were even there, which made me happy. I just finished a mini-series on Predestination, Providence and Perseverance. With seeker-friendly titles like that, I can’t understand why people aren’t standing in line. One funny episode. They couldn’t find a “seven” candle, so they had a “45” with two extra birthday candles.

Sometimes, the greatest effort isn’t by those at the top, but by those coming in last. Yesterday, the Detroit Tigers refused to lose and tie the 1962 Mets record of 120 losses. Staging the biggest comeback since 1965, they came back from 8-0 to beat the Twins 9-8 on a wild pitch in the bottom of the ninth. This one will preach. A great story.

Hey, how BOUT them Hogs!!! These guys are going to send me into early heart attack country.

I’ve been out of town since last Thursday afternoon having a physical/psychological examination to make sure that I am fit for ministry ;-) I saw Luther yesterday and I’ll comment on it more when I have time (we’re about to start church…) I have to say that of the 25-30 people in the theater, there were about 4-5 times when someone laughed out loud and no one else did. That person was me.

More later!

Hey gang. I just got back from two weeks of Navy reserve duty in the great town of San Francisco. Here are a few impressions.

What a gorgeous city. The geographic setting truly is one of the most spectactular in the world.

I’m a diehard country boy from way back, but over my life I have had opportunities to do extended work stints in several metropoli, and have enjoyed them all. In my younger days, I’d have sought out the cultural stuff with a vengeance, but lately I have enjoyed just tramping around the streets, watching the people, having a beer on curbside cafes, etc. I seem to have become something of an appreciative observer rather than a hurried partaker. My favorite thing is to pick up the local paper every morning and just get a feel for the place. The free rags are usually the most amusing.

Well, I recant some of that. I did spend about 9 of my 14 nights scouting out traditional Irish sessions in the local pubs. I played tune after tune with many of the left coast’s nicest musicians. I drove up to 3 hours away from the city, ostensibly to look for outlying pockets of musicians, but actually just to see the countryside. I played sets for ceili dancers in a wee town in the foothills of the Sierras, as well as in one of the most radical leftie pubs in Berkeley.

Out of Sausalito, I took an afternoon sail on Lynx, a reproduction of an 1812 topsail schooner. We tacked around San Francisco bay, having a good-natured fight with our 6-pound guns against the Bay’s other resident square-rigger, Hawaiian Chieftain. By all reckoning, we sank her about twice. She only sank us about once.

During the first week, two America’s cup boats had a rare series of match races only yards from the edge of the waterfront, where they were easily viewable by the public. One was Larry Ellison’s (CEO of Oracle) boat, the other a Swiss boat. These gargantuans towered over everything else in the bay, except for the big container ships of course. It looked quite exciting, and I wish I’d had a better chance to follow their tactics.

I caught the nouveau Irish-American band Solas (Irish for “light”) at the Freight & Salvage in Berkeley.

With my mildly fundamentalist upbringing, I was of course consciously on the lookout for signs of the city’s infamous sexual libertinism and/or “counterculture”. I didn’t have to exert myself to see it everywhere. Lots of same-sex couples. Dudes french kissing each other. Girls with hairy pits. All this- and I didn’t even venture into the Castro, or get close to the UC campus in Berkeley.

What struck me most about the sex thing, however, was the prevalence of sexual perversion in general- of the hetero, not homo, variety. San Francisco seems to be trying to carry on its storied tradition of burlesque in the modern day. The sex district is large and appears well-trammelled, judging from all the ads in the papers and the big marquees streetside.

One of the most interesting experiences a person can possibly have is to walk down a major street in a major city, hustling with queers, bankers, the homeless, Chinese immigrants (the ones I observed were all working quite hard in city uniform, policing the trash…) and think to oneself— “my how God loves all these people.” Without the initial and sustaining, inexplicable grace of God toward me, I would never had been privy to that thought.

The radical pub in Berkeley was a hoot. Apparently it has been in operation for about 3 decades, having been run by a family which was heavily into organized communism. The place is literally plastered with posters (some quite historical) against the Vietnam war, interventions in South America, etc. and promoting various pinko leaders throughout history. I had some of their excellent pizza with a beer, while I read some of the free commie rags in the racks. Very interesting. The only distilling comment I can make about this breed of folks (real, blood & guts revolutionary communists) is that none of them seem to be very happy about anything at all. It must be a pathetic existence. Of course, they would say the same about me—being opiated, as I am.

But, in a rare spirit of generosity, it occurred to me that many of the folks in this neighborhood were onto something. For all its problems, so-called Progressivism has a great strength, especially in areas like this where it is concentrated. Its adherents appear to do very well in issues of community involvement, political awareness, and economic cooperation. If only your typical conservative was as industrious as many of these Berkeley radicals.

Of course, the political highlight of my stay was the gubernatorial debate. Lots of amusing press for that one. I just happened to be in the middle of the Solas concert, with lots of other politically concerned (JN) Progressive Berkeleyites, at the very time this debate was taking place. I have to admit, Arnold exceeded my expectations, judging from the clips I caught later. It seemed he and Arianna were the chief combatants.

Say what you will about either of them, but the thought occurred to me—based on what I heard from both, I think that Arnold would have fewer hard lessons to learn about humanity while serving as a state governor than Arianna would. Californians can take this opinion, with fifty cents, and get themselves a cup of coffee.

No, wait, in SF, it’s at least two bucks for a small cup. But at least there’s plenty of it—if you miss one Starbuck’s, there will be another COMPLETELY DISCRETE Starbuck’s within 40 yards (literally—I saw this with mine own eyes).

Oh, yeah. And the Navy duty was great.

So, other than thinking about my wife and kid every waking moment, I had a good time in fog city. If you ever think of going, remember Mark Twain’s tired old saw- “the coldest winter I ever spent was summer in San Francisco.”

Judd out.

Charles… and any one else who may be interested; I don’t think I can answer that question off the top of my head just now. The question is what have I observed to be the difference between a “reformed” church and a “pentecostal” church. In fact I have been trying to figure it out for at least a year and only now have been starting to get an idea or two. I promise to put my observations into words. But they will have to come later as I reflect a little more. I must be careful because real people are at the root here and it is not simply an academic question. I believe the differences that do exist fall into three separate categories. There are external things which are obvious and can be listed straight away. There are also theological (doctrinal) things that are fairly easy to spot but may not mean anything to some people. But there are deep, hard issues that affect me and that’s where I have to continue contemplating. It’s also possible that my filter, the hardware with which I am living this contrast, is so flawed that my observations may need to be taken with a grain of salt.

Michael: Yeah, I know Luther was human, and the film certainly portrayed that. And my problem isn’t that he’s portrayed as doubtful, depressed, or unsure of himself some of the time. It’s that he’s portrayed like this MOST of the time in the movie. I do think the scenes at Worms were done VERY well, and I do appreciate the brief flashes of passion we see occasionally – but they’re all too brief. Maybe I’m just cranky…

To Our Liberal Writer on Censored Stories: I found it very interesting when I opened the link that my browser indicated that there were errors on your page. In fact, I am proud that Microsoft appears to have installed a BS detector in its latest version of IE, and identifies BS as an “error”.

Don’t worry. I’m a fair guy. Just like I do with Jack Chick, I’m going to offer you some help… I’m going to list your errors.

1. Conservatives planning world domination: Uh… excuse me? No offense, my little love-in havin’ pot smokin’ hippified Bill Clinton intership applicant, but I’m pretty conservative, and I have yet to have been invited to any meetings about taking over the world. I have, however, noticed large gatherings of anarchists, communists, and liberals all whining about how a dictator who violated a military treaty has received his just desserts. Is this some part of a neoliberal plan for global dominance? Hmm… Well, if so, that’ll be a neat trick, since Earth is not a globe most liberals seem to be living on.

2. Homeland Security threatens civil liberties: Uh… first, how has THIS been censored? I rarely go by a night when I don’t hear Dan Blather droning on about more concerns about Homeland Security. I do, however, find your comment about how in 1999 (when your good boss-shoulda-been was Prez) sent in a top-secret military command unit that no one has ever heard of called “Delta Force” to infiltrate your anti-globalization mobs. Uh, first… Delta Force is so secret that there have only been about six movies called “Delta Force”. Chuck Norris – you know – karate dude? Yeah…. second, I personally think that the Delta Force, who is involved in Special Operations – as in training local insurgents to fight off oppresive dictators and conducting secret military raids usually ending in the death of everyone involved – would have the time or desire to surround themselves with your violent little love-in.

3. US illegally removes pages from Iraq report – Uh, I heard about this, too. Nice job of censorship… Probably government work. Do you think that, oh, I don’t know, the possibility may have crossed some intellegence officer’s mind that letting out secret information about a country we may be going to war with that involves the chemical makeup of weapons of mass destruction might not be a good thing to release to Peter Jennings?

4. Rumsfeld’s plan to provoke terrorists – Censored news story. Hmm… An article written by an analyst – not a reporter gathering facts, but a guy paid to give his opinion – who somehow has access to “classified documents” the relate to the war the US is fighting? And this is credible because…..

5. The effort to make unions disappear – like this is new news. Honeygirl, let me tell you, I live in the state that liked Jesse Helms so much we elected him five times, and every time he got in, he promised to work to make unions disappear. In fact, Republicans have been trying to do this for decades. Your story is so censored that it’s been a known historical fact since the early 1900’s. Maybe censored isn’t a good word to describe this. Maybe “Historical Fact That I Should Have Learned In High School But I Was Too Busy Drooling Over Pictures Of David Bonior While Smoking Enough Refer To Kill A Horse And Dreaming Up Paranoid Hippy Fantasies”.

6. Closing Access to Information Technology: Wow… and they’re doing such a good job that you were able to publish this “information” on the freaking internet. Information that’s been available on the same internet for at least a year now.

7. Treaty Busting by the US: Yet another censored story I heard about on CNN, ABC, NBC, CBS, PMS, ASAP, SWAT, and several other acronyms. Oh, and those treaties had withdrawal stipulations which the US followed. Any other country in the world can withdraw the same way. Iraq could have withdrawn from the treaty from the 1991 war, too. Of course, since it’s a military treaty, they’d have found themselves floating in the Persian Gulf even quicker than they did this time…

8. Depleted Uranium use by the US and UK: Yet ANOTHER “censored” story that I’ve heard about for the past 8 years. In fact, you know what? I heard a story a couple of nights ago, complete with some reported expressing their highly scientific concerns about DU.

9. Afghanistan’s situation worse than ever: You specifically say that women’s rights are worse. This is interesting, because last time I checked, women weren’t required to wear Burkas and avoid being seen in public. And the last time I checked – you didn’t grow up in Afghan culture… did you know that most of the women who adopt those limitations do so out of desire – not oppression? Oh – I’m sorry. Your History of Feminism textbook tells you differently. That’s good. Keep reading. It’ll be a nice change from the rest of this article.

Oh – and I’d heard this already, and heard it disproven. Does that count?

10. Africa faces new threat of colonialism: You know what? This is the first one of your points I had actually not heard. Although, to be honest, I’m not sure if it’s a matter of the story being censored, or of the majority of Americans not giving a flying fart about Africa unless “The Lion King” is in theaters. It’s pretty sad if it’s true, but given the rest of your facts… well, let’s just be gentle and call your record to date “a bunch of bullplop”.

There you have it. One possible out of ten. Hmm… Good work. Let me guess – ten percent is pretty close to the grades you got in history, right? Don’t worry. Even Benny Hinn gets about 10 percent of his predictions right. Mostly ones like “I’m going to scratch my arm in the next three seconds” and “My magic jacket will make a bunch of trusting fools flop around like choking fish”.

Signed,
Your Friends at the BHT.

7.

Bruce: What do you see as the main difference between the Pentecostal movement and the reformed denomination you are currently in? I realize it is probably hard to boil down just to one thing, but I would be interested in hearing from you on this. Other than attending about 1 or 2 services and conversations with Pentecostal friends, I have not much experience with the Pentecostals at all. Nor have I ever had a reformed church experience either. I still find it amazing that I have come to share many of the beliefs that reformed people hold.

Charles: I do not worship the local deities. In all major state sports it’s GO CARDS. But today it was CUBS WIN! CUBS WIN! CUBS WIN!

I really should not post predictions yet, because I am an idiot and also because there are a lot of good teams in this post-season, and not so great teams playing well. But stupidity never held me back before.

Cubs vs Braves: Against all reason, I will take the Cubs pitching over the Braves bats at this point. Cubs in 5. I want the magic!
Giants vs Marlins: Giants are rested, ready and confident. Marlins are playing on emotion, and I don’t believe their pitching can do it. Giants in three.

A’s vs. Sox: This is too awful to contemplate. I love both these teams right now. Two teams who have a lot of fun and put a lot of runs on the board. A’s in five.
Yanks vs Twins: Anyone but the Yanks. 13-0 Yankees vs Twins this year, but they were all in April. The Yanks are ripe for a defeat, but it won’t happen. Yanks (ugh) in 5. May I be very wrong.

I still think the SEC brand of football is the best in the USA. Florida & Kentucky and Alabama & Arkansas gave us two – very typical – exciting games today. Both were nail biters and neither game was decided until late, very late in the case of Arkansas and Alabama.

Michael: Sorry about the Cats. Many moons ago the Cats had the Gators down several touchdowns. A young QB named Wuerfel came off the bench and won the game for Florida.

Matthew: How ‘bout them Hawgs!!!!!!!!!!!1

The MAC is coming on strong. N. Illinois beats Iowa State today. They are 3-0.

College football is crazy. ND beats Washington State. Michigan beats ND. Oregon beats Michigan. Washington State pounds Oregon today.

Lots of upsets today. A good Saturday.

I do enjoy reading Ann Coulter’s stuff. I have a certain amount of appreciation for the provocateur that I thought you- as a fellow blogger and lay-pundit- might share ;-). But I certainly could join you in much of your critique. I would point out that Coulter is reviewing the book written by David Limbaugh, and offers his documentation to the reader. My own point was simply that liberalism, in its incarnation as guardians of the young, seems particularly hostile towards children if they are not sufficiently Sesame Streetish. (I would say that Coulter may irritate with attitude, but the documentation in both Slander and Treason has only been challenged in the most minor and ineffective ways.) If you look at her bio, she surpasses most of the other pundit class in that she is a legitimate legal scholar. That she chooses to answer a fool according to his folly is her choice, and frankly, after reading what the liberals at Transy were attempting to force into the mind of my daughter, I am all for her having all Ann’s books for Christmas.

Michael: I guess I should have followed your Coulter link. That’s the exact article I looked at. The Raymond Raines thing rung a bell. The Islam thing at the end is a bit overblown, too. I’m pretty sure that the Kayla Broadus story is 100% legit, though “the school’s efforts to teach proper sexual techniques in the first grade.” seems a little bit, well, hysterical. The official word on the Lynn Lucas case spells things out a little differently than She Who Speaks Loudly And Incessantly describes them, but no matter. Her devotees will shrug over the very minor discrepancies, while critics will hold them up as more than they are. I’ll stop after pointing out that Coulter gives the impression that the religious tiles were the only ones rejected, and implies that they were rejected on the basis of some sort of religious discrimination. In fact, many other tiles were also rejected, and the reasoning given for rejecting all of them, including the religious ones, held up in court and actually makes a bit of sense to me, too. Do you really want to see your kids school decorated with alternating tiles reading “God is Love” and “God is Hate?”

Anyway, color me not-a-fan of the blonde blowhard. I watched her on Bill Maher’s show one Saturday night and thought, “This is what people are so excited about? Yet another blind parrot, Rush Limbaugh without the class?” Sigh.

With a full belly, I can think more clearly. :-)

Amanda: I’ll add a couple of points. You are, of course, welcome to pop over to my house for dinner any time you want a smoke-free dining environment. We don’t allow smoking in our house, even by dearly loved relatives. If I ever get around to smoking a pipe (doubtful, though I do love the smell), I’ll do so outside, well away from the house.

Also, the reasoning that one has a right to a smoke-free environment wherever one goes strikes me as eerily similar to the notion that athiests have a right to go through life without seeing large crosses or manger scenes. This country was certainly not founded upon any sort of idea that one should have an annoyance-free life. It was, in fact, founded very much with the idea of ensuring that people would be offended at every opportunity, and the offenders have the upper hand, constitutionally speaking. That’s the downside to the rights of free speech and public assembly: I’m as likely to encounter a raving pacifist on the way to the grocery store as a street preacher on a soapbox, maybe more so. I can ignore him (as I do), or argue with him, but he can be there regardless of my opinion on his pet subject.

In fact, I’ve long tried to help people understand that what makes America great is that despite the freedoms we’ve been given, most of us choose a nice safe life in which we don’t bother our neighbors much. We all have the constitutionally-protected right to be really, really obnoxious, but we choose not to be. Or most of us do, anyway. Perhaps, as some argue, that is the natural consequence of an equal society. We all understand that others have as much right to annoy us as we have to annoy them, and so we hit on this unspoken arrangement where we try not to annoy each other too much. Perhaps, I argue back, it’s just divine providence and American cultural values and even the same exact Constitution wouldn’t work with another group of people.

Finally, there were a couple of mistakes in my last post. I meant to say that the labor laws in California assume that an employee may not have any other choice about where to work, not Texas. Here, the employers generally have the upper hand. And when I said that many smaller bars fired of their employees, I meant to emphasize that they did so in order to continue to allow smoking.

So smoking sucks, and I’d like to see it fade away into something to be practiced at home and generally not around me. While it bothers me, I seem to remember (but I’m too lazy to search right now) you saying that you can have asthmatic reactions to cigarette smoke, so I realize that this is definitely not an academic issue for you. Bummer. At least the cross-hating athiests don’t have an actual physical reaction to torment them!

Bruce: I meant to say earlier that I love Ikea, and I wish they would open a store a little closer to me. It’s nearly a five-hour drive to Houston. It would certainly be five hours coming back heavily laden with stuff!

The chief aim and purpose of man is to glorify God, no question. It is worth noting, however, that Paul does suggest an intimacy with God that is generally lacking in other religions. To be sure, the American church on the whole is pushing emotionalism and “personal relationship” over everything, but I do believe that relationship is important and that a constant reminder of it can help to keep us from blind obedience and legalism. I am constantly reminded that such repetitive forms as the Lord’s Prayer are just words in one sense, but they also represent to me the incredible fact that I can approach God Himself on the basis of His grace and the work of His Son. Wow! He knows the number of hairs on my head and cares when I brush too aggressively; that’s pretty amazing considering that on my own I’m less than insignificant!

In Amanda’s defense, I’ve stopped in Denton once or twice and not been that impressed with the restaurants. Amanda, I suggest that you swing on down to Carrollton, where there is no smoking in restaurants. And no bars, either, ‘bars’ defined as an establishment which earns 50% or more from alcohol sales. Rumor has it that Chili’s in Carrollton has more than once used that law as an excuse to get people in the bar area to buy food with each and every beer near the end of the month.

Anyway, Amanda, I’m not sure I could possibly disagree with you any more on the subject of laws and society and so on. The subject of smoking is interesting, and not the best subject on which base a discussion of a nanny state because there are so many factors, but I’ll give it a go. California banned smoking in almost all places of business not based on any sort of protection for customers or the general public, but because employees might be harmed by second-hand smoke. If customers don’t like the smoke, they can always go elsewhere, which is exactly the choice you have. Don’t like the smoke in a restaurant? Leave. Go home, go to the grocery store, drive to Carrollton, whatever, but you have the freedom to leave. You do not have the freedom to place restrictions on every person you encounter to ensure a smoke-free environment wherever you go. That’s not a right, it’s tyranny of the minority in a very real sense. You set the rules on your own property, and the owners of other property set the rules on theirs. The issue California used to get around this quite obvious problem with their urge to ban smoking is that employees don’t have the same freedoms that patrons do. It is still over-reaching, though I admit to really liking the smoke-free result. The labor laws in Texas assume that an employee may not have any other choice about where to work, and so now only bars with no employees can allow smoking. Don’t laugh – many smaller bars fired all of their employees and are now run entirely by the owners!

Sadly, by overreaching, the government has in California, New York and maybe Carrollton too, succeeded in eliminating a competitive tool for businesses. I had been observing a general push in the direction of expanded no-smoking zones and entire chains of restaurants choosing to ban smoking, slowly, and now that’s over. With it imposed from outside, there is only resentment, and smoking is pushed out into area it wasn’t generally acceptable before.

Anyway, we have historically had no laws designed to keep people from harming themselves. Laws exist to keep people from harming others. The primary rationale behind seatbelt laws and speeding laws both have to do with the cost to the state (that’s you and me, the taxpayers) of increased accidents and fatalities and so on. Amusingly, statistics come out every year showing that more accidents are caused by people driving too slowly than by people driving too quickly, though fatalities go the other way.

There are no laws against committing suicide, the big legal fuss is over whether another person can help someone commit suicide. Why? Because it opens up a strange legal gray area where we can’t necessarily be sure whose idea the death was. A solo suicide makes things pretty clear, usually.

God protect us from well-meaning politicians and the sincere wishes of good people to keep others from harming themselves! It is by degrees rather than revolution that we descend into the abyss, and beyond that, dissolution.

Bruce: I never complained about the CRC in general, just the church near my house – which happens to be CRC – specifically. My old church that I just left had gone through some interesting changes after a pastor’s wife was killed by a drunk driver. It’s a devastating thing, and a stern reminder that life doesn’t just line up the way the current trend in pentecostalism seems to say. I pray that Kenneth Copeland never, ever faces the devastation that such a murder would cause, but I do wonder how it might shape his (currently atrocious) theology if his wife or daughter was the victim of a drunk driver.

The logic on following people away from a bar is a little funny, and I’m not sure I quite agree with it, but the general idea is that it essentially amounts to entrapment and would result in a lot of harassment. I generally bounce back and forth with thinking that driving with a certain blood-alcohol should not in and of itself be illegal on the one hand, especially in light of a plethora of science showing that the same BAC level has radically different effects on different people, and thinking that a single DUI ought to result in a life-long loss of driving privileges on the other. Fortunately, I’m not a politician, so I won’t ever have my emotions manipulated into passing a law that messes with the lives of millions. In any case, I wouldn’t particularly have a problem with cops following people home from bars, so long as they waited until they saw actual evidence of poor driving or slow responses or something before pulling someone over and they were forbidden to follow for more than X minutes to avoid harassment.

Michael: I know you like Annie (“She who must be heard”), but not only does she get on my nerves, and not only does she deliberately provoke people needlessly, I think she’s full of absolute crap. Someone (C&S?) pointed to an essay of hers the other day in which she ran down a list of scary stories about religion repression in schools, and I recognized one or two of them as having been debunked years ago. Years! The article implied that they were current events. That’s the sort of thing that Franken should expose in my book, though he’s a lying liar himself.

I’ll stop now. It’s dinnertime, and I’ve annoyed enough people for one day. ;-)

Tim:

As I have implied in a previous post, having separate smoking and non-smoking section does not necessarily keep the smoke from travelling to the non-smoking section.

She who must be heard reviews David Limbaugh’s book. Even though it is the genre of whining, you still can’t read this stuff without being stunned at the hostility of liberals towards CHILDREN. It may be sensational, but its irritating, and yes, maddening, in its stupidity.

Bruce: Thinking of leaving this soon? Say it ain’t so. If I recall, the general population of the BHT didn’t trash the CRC- I wouldn’t allow it frankly- but there was a discussion of Phillip’s experience and its connection to what some say were certain ethnic characteristics of the Dutch Reformed population in general. If you recall, when the general critiquing of the Dutch began, there was plenty of animated discussion, and some- like me- weren’t too excited. I think most of us were on your team. You should have joined in. Lurking on issues that you have an opinion on – known in the BHT as “Matthew Johnson Syndrome (SW)” is frowned upon by the spirits of the blog.

The phrase “personal relationship” no longer means anything to me. When I hear someone say it, I know nothing. “Relationship” is OK, if we could please fill in some blanks. “Covenant relationship” is not so absurdly redundant, and does make sense in a Biblical context. The purpose of life, Christian or not, is to glorify God by enjoying Him in whatever way we relate to God, His creation or other persons.